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Friday June 20, 2001

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The attachment is one of Jan B's terrific picture/poems.

Caution: was a heavy posting day, sigh.
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Eric Blackstead
Subject: [NDS] Jerry & the Word

Friends,

First there was the Word, and the Word was "Test".

Jerry looked upon his work and he saw it was good, and he said, "And they're
off..."

Harsha aka Dr. Harsha K. Luthar aka HarshaIMTM@xxx.xxx aka Harsh (Harsha)
K.Luthar,Ph. aka Harshal(Harsha)MTM-Harsh(Harsha)K, consulting his various
identities, put his finger up in the air and asked: Re:PHD??orABC's??...". He
was clearly "off", as well.

Perhaps he (they?) were calling out to Dan Berkow, who also signed himself
(Ph-d). Dan's 1st word turned on itself and asked , "Who are You?" and then
promply disappeared. Dan has been trying to recover Who He Is ever since.
Apparently, Ph-d was merely an assumed identity. He was not only "off",but
also "on". Go figure.

Gloria Lee was in there at the beginning as well. But she was very subtle, or
perhaps shy, and she spurned caps as gloria lee. She was so subtle, that we
can't really identify exactly when she was "off", but she definitely was.
"Off" that is.

Yes, we all got "off" as a group, so to speak, with Jerry's original Word:
"Test". That was 57,072 entries ago. My mind is "Boggled". I can't conceive
of it. Fifty Seven Thousand and Seventy Two entries ago...now, Seventy Three.

Harsha has finally resolved his identity crisis as simply Harsha and owns the
companion site to this one, Harshasatsang. Gloria Lee, Glo or Glee, seems to
be seeking her own multi-name identity crisis in loving surrender to Harsha's
path as the moderator over at the Satsang. Judi is the indisputed boss of the
End of the Rope Ranch, and Dan is a ubiquitous presence where ever identity
is the issue. And of course Jerry remains the Patriarch and Emminence Gris of
this site.

As another Jerry said, "What a strange journey it (must have) been".
(Parenthesis mine.) Congratulations. you've all done a mind boggling job just
to survive the rigors of so much cyber-verbality. Long may you endure... (in
what ever identity you find appropriate, of course).

yours in the bonds,
eric

JERRY

Chin reports the following link on his list, Wide Open Windows.

http://www.theawakeningwest.com/addl_inter.html

and here is another:
David Spero.
http://www.divinemothersatsang.org


JABBA

Hi Jerry,

I was looking at your links to Dave Oshana's enlightenment teachings
and see that they do not list his official website

http://www.oshana.org

it has been recently acquired, and promises to explain and portray
themes from The Matrix/ Matrix II starring Keanu Reeves as Neo/ The
One, and have a some unique Awakening music from www.Xenmusic.co.uk

jabba

MICHAEL READ
merlin@ wrote:
snip -
> yes, this seems quite important. Not to disvalue this
> theme, I wanted to say/add that an even more direct
> desire, which is necessary, would be the desire to be
> free of conditioning and to realize an inner power and
> freedom of being, and also to realize our True Nature.
>
> --merlin

Thanks, Merlin.

What I attempted to point out was how the desire - to know the truth
or the reason that anything exists at all - is a natural force. It may
seem that the individual is doing the desire or the seeking. Now, if I
say that it just happens, some would find this idea uncomfortable and
reject it out of hand. The arising of the desire to know is like the
arising of hunger.

When we are hungry for food, really hungry, the desire and the quest
for food supercedes everything. We don't think about anything else or
want any distractions - we MUST have food NOW! We will do anything to
get some food! Our personality, identity, everything is subsumed in
the need to eat.

Once we have some consumed some food and the natural force of our
hunger is abated (at least for the time being) our personality returns
and we can be our usual pleasant self again.

The desire to know the truth with a capital T is a force like
overwhelming hunger. It drove Jesus out into the desert for 40 days
and Gautama sat under the Bo tree for weeks. Many others have given
thier whole lives over to this desire.

It is not a personal desire. It may appear to start out that way. It
is like an itch that creeps up on us or a nagging feeling that
something is out of place somewhere. Over time the itch grows until no
amount of scratching will stop it. We may find temporary relief with
the ointments of religion, philosophy, strong drink, or avoidance.

Until we reach the point where - like the hungry person - we become
willing to give everything even our life. And, again I want to stress
that this is a natural process totaly outside of the control of the
so-called individual. Until we stop seeking for personal power and
trying to satisfy ourselves with a logical answer or a devotional
belief system we will not be open to the answer to our quest.

If I say that I realized god, or that I became enlightened, I would be
wrong. The character 'Michael Read' was caught up in a movement that I
had no control over - none at all! There was only the desire to know
and even that desire was dropped. Oh yes, I had to make the effort.
Effort is 'knocking on the door' as Jesus said. Up to that point it
certainly seemd that I was the doer, the seeker. And, I have to
confess that there was a time when what I sought was for 'personal'
gain. What I wanted was an answer that made sense out of everything.

At the moment when true surrender happened and the answer came there
was no more 'Michael Read' to enjoy it! There is no way to describe
that moment and what it opened. Why? Simply put, it is beyond
intellectual conceptualizing or understanding. When we hear the phrase
'conciousness is all there is - all there is is conciousness' we may
try to understand it or we may accept it as some sort of truth.
However, it is a meager description!

When I talk about letting go of the concepts and beliefs, allowing
intuitition guide one through this natural process, it is the best
'advice' that I can offer. One thing that happens during this process
is that a stream of 'information' and 'power' comes through. The
ego/mind/body complex begins to become overwhelmed at this point. In
defense of its apparent 'reality' the ego/mind/body naturally wants to
stop the flow at some point. At almost any point! :-)

This process is the 'death' of the ego/mind/body. As this 'death'
occurs what has always been there shines with its own light. The use
of light and shines is a pitiful metaphore for what I am trying to
convey. I am not talking about an individual seeing light forms or
such as that. What shines is the universal awareness that gives rise
to the entire play and game of life.

Once this 'death' occurs the seeking stops. Period. There is no desire
to 'relive' the experience.

If it so happens that at some point during the flow of information and
power is stopped before the process has run its course, well, one
might accidentally become 'God in the Flesh', a 'satguru', or some
other form of 'elevated master'! And the drama continues! :-)

Live - laugh - love and be happy - Michael

DAN BERKOW


He doesn't have to dish out enlightenment.
There is nowhere it is not.

Need I say more? :-)

Heh, heh .. oh yes, one more thing ...
I'll have one bundt pan full of enlightenment, please ...

Need I say more? :-)

Okay -- teaching *this* is quite impossible.
No one can give it, demonstrate it, or make it
happen. It's never even spoken its name,
let alone started a satsangh, religion, or teaching.

Doesn't stop anyone from trying though -- satsanghs,
ranches, salons, churches, mosques, temples -- what
a show! Attitudes, opinions, techniques,
nonapproaches -- don't ya love it?

I'll be in my cave, preaching to the ants and roaches.
It will be just as fruitful as all the rest of the
ever-more-silly circus around
"enlightenment" "awakening", and so on ...

Need I say more? :-)

Well, if you insist, just
want to say:
"follow me, I'll set you free!"

Oh, and one more thing:

I love you,
Dan

DOC HOBBES

> > Do changes to this story here/now create changes for the past?
>
>***** Has no relevance.

Not to us. But perhaps those events would change (a single mind must change)
thus yeilding a different reality that we would, in time, naturally merge
into. All time at once.

I mean, clearly they can hear us back there I mean who are they hearing in
their heads?

Like this. The four quadrants (+,+), (+,-), (-,-), (-,+)... I suggest that
most of us either live in the (+,-) or (-,+) quadrants which are the dual
model of thinking where one is opposed to the other and is either ahead (+)
or behind (-). Death, or transformation, is what moves us through the cycles
or quadrants.

The (+,+) and the (-,-) are the same in the sense that we all win or we all
lose but again, to lose or win one must lose or win to something.

Regardless, these two quadrants are the aim as they represent the 'perfected
path of no mistakes' or the 'perfected path of every mistake'.

Like the 'fork in the road' (get that J), the mirror is up where half the
mind goes one way and half the mind the other (through the thought
processing decision) and death then, becomes the flip-flopping from side to
side. The goal then is find 'balance in the extremes' (0,0,0,0:00) so that
one 'is the same life' on both ides of the line.

Thus, no bardos are experienced at the time of death nor is there lost time.
Day after day.

Time is like the rings in a tree. When you were born, smallest ring, quick
loop, no memory. As one gets to five years, bigger loop, more space to
circle, more awareness.

At 20, bigger loop, more awareness, even more time to do the cycle...
jezzzz! By the time you are like 50 years old or something time must take
forever! lol... the best part is that the outer most ring, is the first
ring. As for all those rings in between.... other times, other places, other
yous.

No relevance? I disagree. One tree. What is the half-life of a light being?



o
-- hobbes


GREG GOODE on dropping conditioning

Hi Ed,

This makes a lot of sense, not everyone has the same issue or question.
There are things that are quite helpful in undoing this visual
conditioning. Not in just an intellectual way, a way that would consist
largely of verbal reformulation. But rather the very process of sensory
affect the very process of vision itself, indeed the conditioning of all
the so-called "senses." It just won't seem like you are seeing "things out
there" anymore, separated by a gap from yourself.

Have you tried:

1. I think at one time, George Berkeley might have had the same issue you
mention. His THREE DIALOGUES BETWEEN HYLAS AND PHILONOUS is his most
accessible, introductory work. GB is the guy who argues that there truly
is no tree in the forest. His best work, but the most technical, was on
vision. He has many different arguments to show that there cannot be
external pieces of matter that cause perceptions in us of external pieces
of matter. I've never seen his philosophy refuted - though it is not too
popular!

2. Douglas Hardings perceptual exercises. First published in ON HAVING NO
HEAD. Since that is out of print, you can try www.headless.org, where
there are many exercises. Perceptual nonduality.

3. Krishna Menon's ATMA DARSHAN. One of the most compressed and compelling
arguments ever written for the conclusion that objects of the senses are
nothing other than "consciousness shining in its own glory." His basic
technique is to show that objects cannot exist without the seeing of
objects. One of his most original contributions is to show how the very
senses themselves (vision, hearing, etc.) are objects of consciousness in
the same way as the pot and the music.

There are others, but these are the, er, shortest!

Love,

--Greg

AND

Hello CloudForestTree,

The teaching also applies to the teaching. The belief in belief is among
the last to go. But these recursive thingies tend to happen a bit later
than the other stuff such as "I don't believe in ego."

Love,
--Greg



JERRY "stolen words"

enlightenment is so natural

it's effortless.


Hello Ron,

The essay, are you referring to this piece on Chandrakirti's 7-fold reasoning?

http://www.harshasatsangh.com/Magazine/7fold-f.htm

Love,

--Greg

At 06:05 PM 7/20/01 -0000, ron perrymore wrote:
>Good morning all,
>A few days ago I discovered an essay written by Greg Goode on the middle
path or the way of emptiness. It is published on Harshas list.
>
>The message is, there is no self existant anything and that includes all
identities who are convinced that their body/mind is something that they
somehow "own", or that their given identity is a precious jewel to be
polished with the scriptures.
>
>Finding that essay and working through the logic presented helped to make
sense of the growing emptiness that I am experiencing.
>

MYSTRESS ANGELIQUE SERPENT


At 10:15 AM 7/20/01, Joyce wrote:
>Well - it's impossible to enlighten another.
> One of the dumbest career choices someone
> could make. Not that there won't be many
> destined to make it. And what is there to
> do, but "fulfill one's destiny" -- whatever that
> may be. It's truly inevitable. Whatever it may be ;-)

Well, I cannot help it. A grrl's gotta eat, after all, and I have no
other professional qualifications.

I had to retire as a Pro-Dominatrix because the side effect of
accidentally K. awakening my clients appeared non consensual. I was
accidentally awakening people when I was a hairstylist, too, but I didn;t
realize it and I became allergic to the chemicals.

Goddess has been telling me to pursue a career in professional
enlightenment and spiritual teaching since I was in high school, I held out
resisting as long as I could because the advice made no sense to me.. but
finally I ran out of other options. So, it must be my destiny. :) :) :) As
Goddess Wills.

As far as career choices go tho, I'm not at all dissatisfied. I'm
charging the same rate for enlightenment without spankings as with, (when I
charge anything at all) the wardrobe is cheaper and much more comfortable.
There is less equipment involved, although the advertising budget is much
the same. Plus, I get a bigger slice of the market share. There are a lot
more people seeking enlightenment than torture.
Sure, I work for free quite a lot, but the work is very rewarding in
other ways, and I do occasionally get donations well beyond my hourly rate.
Plus the generous karmic benefits plan. It all balances out just fine.

Really.. unless you have tried it out for yourself as a career choice,
who are you to judge?

I can see how you might not have the talent for it tho.. I remember
your advice to me on HS. "Go take an aspirin".. hmm.. That might have
helped with the PMS, but it would not have done a thing for temporary
possession by someone's MPD ego fragment. Still that too was destiny and it
all worked out extremely well, in the end. I appreciate your efforts..
sincerely.

Blessings!



Dear List,

A past member of the K-list asked me to forward this. The File is open to
all, and can be viewed by going to http://au.egroups.com/files/emcaf/.

Anyone who wants to add his/her experiences please contact Dick at
rwr@eggconnect.net

Of course we'd also love to hear your experiences here too!

Love, Hillary

*****************

Request for Experiences.

The EMCAF Foundation is a newly set up establishment for collecting personal
accounts of a specific type of experience (details below), and operating
predominantly on the internet. The object is to collect as many first hand
accounts as possible (world wide) which will be used in a database for
analysis and dissemination. Just a few organisations have done such a project
for a number of years but their accounts are not readily available for anyone
to read without being a member of that organisation or holding the requisite
academic qualifications for analytical study. The type of experience
predominantly required is that which could be called by various names such
as: an experience of union, or reunion with the all, or the ground of being:
or a Transcendent Mystical Unitive Experience in which ones consciousness is
experienced to unite with the highest or deepest power; one in which the
individual experiences themselves to be in a realm or dimension beyond space,
time, and any memory of ever being in this world. And hence a most profound
and mysterious life changing and enhancing occurrence. However, another file
folder also exists for any kind of spiritual or life changing experience, and
personal biographies thereof. This method of archiving allows anyone to
deposit a spiritual/mystical experience, or to read such files, whilst
without having to be a member of any organisation, and the costs which that
may involve.

Authors of such personal experiential biographies will retain the copyright
to the article; but they will be available for anyone to read, and may
possibly be passed on to other reputable organisations making a study of
consciousness and spiritual experiences and the lasting effects thereof.
Authors may remain anonymous if they prefer, or even add an email contact for
readers and or researchers to follow up on in due course.

Anyone wishing to submit such an account/biography (they can be any length
which the writer feels the experience or series of experiences warrant)
should ...be sent to rwr@eggconnect.net
And files can be accessed at emcaf@yahoogroups.com
snip


SU & MICHAEL READ

> I cannot deny my mystical experiences. Nor can I deny my daily life
of separateness. Both are real. One just feels really good, so it's
easy to want to be there all the time, to believe that it's possible
and desirable to do so. Whether it is or it isn't ain't my affair.
What's happening in *this* moment?, now that's rich.
>

No need to deny them. They 'happened' as part of story. Part of the
passion play of life so to speak.

Soon, I think, you will have the experience of awakening that will end
the feeling of separateness. You are quite more open than you may
think you are. Yup! Oh you are gonna have a good laugh!

> > The belief that we are separate keeps us separate.
> > Those old mystics who say that god is playing all the parts are
> right.
>
> What parts? The *separate* parts? ;)

The apparently separate parts.

>
> I enjoy this exchange, because although the gist of how you will
reply is predictable, the *particular* flavor that "Michael" will do
it in is not. The fact that you bring a whole life of conditioning and
genetics and all that good stuff to the table makes me be able to
see you beyond any judgements that may occur.
>

Yah.
It probably seems predictable. Gotta use the usual words. heehee

Well, if you've seen one awakened nobody in the vastness of the
universe, you've seen them all. Or, like Buddha said, "There are no
enlightened beings and there is no end of enlightened beings."

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