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Friday November 10. 2000




The fool is ALWAYS oneself. In other words, if there is a perceived
"me" to scoff at "you," then foolishness can be assigned as a GIVEN to
that perceived "me." And if "I" take offense at some scoffing, then
there are two fools instead of just one.
Love2U2,"

Tim,

Yes, I'm in total agreement.

Except 4 1 thing. You had to say it, didn't you. I mean, you
couldn't just let it pass, knowing what you know. Knowing what you
know, you still had to let me know. You still had to let me know what
you know that I already know, right?

What we know is the signified.

What points to what we know is the signifier.

We know that the signifier never really indicates the signified, due
to the distortions of language, the contradictions of which we speak.
Right?

So what difference does it make if we signify the signified or not?

We want to make a difference. We want to be significant. We want
to be the signifier that signifies the signified.

We have egos. Egos are signifiers. And yet we don't want to be
signifiers. We want just to be the signified.

So we make fun of all signifiers, all egos. And claim that all that
matters is the signified.

But that's precisely what an ego is! An ego is a signifier that
claims that signification makes no difference. And ego claims that only
the signified matters. And yet, to the ego, making that claim is all
that really matters.

The essence of ego is

I DON'T MATTER, NO EGO, NO SIGNIFIER, MATTERS. BUT IT REALLY
MATTERS FOR ME TO BE THE ONE TO SAY THAT. BECAUSE I MATTER ENOUGH (TO BE
SIGNIFICANT ENOUGH, TO MAKE A DIFFERENCE ENOUGH) TO SAY THAT.

And not even "silence" gainsays that.
Even ego uses "silence" to signify the signified.

love
~*~
sky

_______________________________________________________________

The cure for
the disease of
enlightenment is
to lose concern
about being enlightened
or unenlightened, and,
of course, about whether others
are enlightened or
unenlightened.

The absence that is presence
is neither absent nor present.

Love,
Dan

_______________________________________________________

Does the gulf between teachings of "sudden enlightenment" and "gradual
enlightenment" disappear suddenly or gradually? Who sees the distance? The
distance between the Eye - "I" and all things depends on the strength of the
Eye "I". With a strong Eye "I" one can see many things of great beauty and
ugliness. Without the Eye, "I" what can one see? When the "I" goes,
everything goes. When the foundation crumbles, the whole house collapses.
Where is the ceiling and where is the floor?
How does the point of distance between "sudden" and "gradual" enlightenment
arise?

Hey! What's happening baby?

Love to all
Harsha

~~~
The point of distance
between sudden and gradual,
enlightened and unenlightened,
arises because there is
no point of distance.

Because there is no distance,
we can talk about distance.

If there were distance,
we wouldn't be able to
speak or hear.

Love,
Dan
The point of distance
between sudden and gradual,
enlightened and unenlightened,
arises because there is
no point of distance.

Because there is no distance,
we can talk about distance.

If there were distance,
we wouldn't be able to
speak or hear.

Love,
Dan


______________________________________________________________

>Some say that Enlightenment is "sudden", as if struck by lightening, and one
>is never the same. Some say that Realization takes place "gradually" and
>just as the clouds evaporate and dissipate with the wind and the rain, Sun
>eventually shines brightly. Both views are meaningful and may be helpful. No
>perspective can embrace the Truth without a frame of reference and yet Truth
>embraces all perspectives and admits no reference point. There is no point
>in clinging to either the "sudden" path or the "gradual" path, and no point
>in resisting clinging. Having nothing to gain or lose, the wise ones are
>comfortable supporting many perspectives and do not mind inconsistencies.
>
>Love to all
>Harsha

DAN

Several one
viewpoint reality
expressed maintained
at once never
could have been
never was
inconsistent
constant
stated
unsaid
here
there

_____________________________________________________________

An ornithologist may say
the bird sings
to attract a mate
and warn other birds
he's a bad bird dude

Bird doesn't say
Song doesn't say
Bird appears
Song appears
for ever and ever, just now
evernow
I am birdsongbirdsongbirdsongbird
just now

love,
andrew

_______________________________________

ww humbly nominates you for the best Koan of the Year award! ^^ ~~~
>
> How does the point of distance between "sudden" and "gradual"
> enlightenment arise?
>
ww's answer for today:

how much distinction is there between
that which arises and that which falls?
is there any real difference between
that which is sudden and that gradual?

we are neither slaves nor free

these and all dualities are non real
mere dreams of a slumbering mind
dusky phantoms of a fickle heart
duality results from chosen bondage

neither free nor slaves are we

what difference is there between
chosing freedom as bondage, or
chosing bondage as freedom?
sudden rests eternally upon gradual.

we are neither free nor slaves

All are called, all are chosen
All creatures that flourishes arise
All creatures that flourishes fall
All is always returning to becoming

the servant makes the freeman,
the freeman makes the servant.

Reveal this to yourself and you will
discover the still point that is still pointless
and understand the source of all wisdom.

white wolfe
______________________________________________________

Meditation on Nothing

Stop your Chattering Mind. Still your Passionate Heart. Allow yourself to
touch and be touched by what lies beyond....?

"I come from nothing. I am nothing. I return to nothing."
-St. Ignatius
_________________________________________________________

Moller

The tendency is still there to try and explain suffering away with all
the words of non-effort, sudden and so on.
Wake up my friends. We are living in a real world.

Sky:

Right.

But will waking up, etc., taking up your suggestion, stop the suffering?

What will? I say, nothing. Thus, it is said, nothing works. Try it,
it works.
(Not really.)

There is an argument to be made for suddenness. Since nothing works,
just wait for sheer exhaustion. Yet you can't, because that is itself
preparation.

Nothing works. Hence, suddenly.

love
~*~
sky


__________________________________________________________


IVAN: Sri Ramana Maharshi is probably turning around with
great disgust and distress in his grave about what is going
on nowadays under the name of nonduality here.

~
Ivan,

I hope that by now you have begun to see that this disgust and
distress is turning around only in you. Ramana's unconditional
acceptance and love were and are well known.

It is a common trick of the mind to project our cherished beliefs
and feelings onto others, either to avoid recognizing them in
ourselves, or to imagine that authority from another somehow
validates the activities of our unexamined minds.

May I remind you that to follow Ramana's path is *Self* Inquiry,
not *other* inquiry, and certainly not judgement on how folks
are expressing themselves, as they find and are lead in the
discovery of the utter simplicity of Self.

respectfully,
Xan

_______________________________________________________

Dear NDS:

....white wolfe received this from someone onlist who wants this response to be
confidential, but gave permission to share these reflections
anonymously...enjoy...!

Why be troubled by the love making of the turtle? It's skin is of
another dimension, its words are of another convention. Be not
disturbed by the thunder of elephants in heat, their musk is not for
your nostrils, their ardor is not for your heart.

Or would you take the place of the love bird, its harmony a never
ending symphony? Few would contest the honey of your letters. The
field is fertile with invitation for all the living to voice their call.

Think not that one trumpet beckons only. The concert has barely
begun. Sing or listen at will.

Your song is heard. Think not that your passions fail to reach even
the humblest of worms. If the eagle's talons rip your core, this too
makes love to the cosmos we both adore.

But if your pleas are but your song, know they ring true and touch
each rung along the ladder to the throng.

with
awe
and
cosmic
adulation
unimpeded

_________________________________________________________________

White Wolfe


There is One.

The one breaks into two.

The two make three so that the two can heal once again

and return together to the Other which is Love.

There is the Trinity that is The Father, The Mother and The Son.

But really there is only the One that is the Godhead.

There is only the this which is that. There is only I which is Thou.

There is the dream of many. There is reality and its shadow.

There is only the Lover and the Beloved who are One in each Other.

The reality is that I am you, you are mine and we are each other.

For there is no other. There is no self. Without the Beloved there is no Lover.

There is only you interbeing in me. And I interbeing in you.

We are One. We are already the Christ. He is already here among us.

We were, are and will always be not one but two, not two but One.

But we remain asleep and refuse to awake.

So we continue to hurt the each other which is ourselves.



But Now is the Kingdom of Heaven.

We are the Buddha on the road.

We can transcend love and suffering with Love.



When Love finally leaps out of the universe

it will drift into Emptiness,

where there is neither fire nor ice.

The wheel of time and space will slowly stop spinning.

It is behovely

that there be neither dauncing nor singing.

For all of us will take our last steps and sing our final notes in the closing
cadence.

The harmony will resolve back once again into seamless, transcendent silence.

The silence that comes as the Self remembers first and only true Love.



Thank you for being my friend and helping me remember this my Beloved.

Thank you for teaching me how to laugh and cry.

I live in hope that we will be there at the end to finish the dauncing and
singing together.

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