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Sunday July 6, 2000

JOHN and DESIRES:

GENE:
<
A deep study of the universe as seen by Vajrayana will fully
inform you of the inherent traps and hazards to be found in our basic
spiritual infrastructure; specifically, the impulses of AVERSION
and its polar opposite, DESIRE.

You may note, if you look carefully and dispassionately, that
among the population of self-identified followers of various spiritual
paths, that there is shame attached to desire, and yet VIRTUE is
attached to aversion. People speak with pride and passion, of
what they 'abhor', and yet they speak little of what they desire,
having accepted that desire is a flaw.
>

JOHN:
Here's a follow-up on the thread of desire/acceptance. I
guess my desire for Dolly Parton comes under the desire for romance...
Also, what about desires that guide meaningless behavior? Being the
avatar I am, my profile would rank "eating", first, and, "physical
exercise", last.

NEW THEORY OF MOTIVATION LISTS 16 BASIC DESIRES THAT GUIDE US
COLUMBUS, Ohio - Professor Steven Reiss says there's nothing wrong
with workaholics, non-curious schoolchildren and timid people.
While much of society may believe these people have problems that
need to be fixed, Reiss said his research suggests they are probably
happy just the way they are. They just have personalities that don't
fit in with much of society.

Reiss, a professor of psychology and psychiatry at Ohio State
University, has spent five years developing and testing a new theory
of human motivation. The result of his research is published in the
new book Who Am I? The 16 Basic Desires That Motivate Our Action and
Define Our Personalities (Tarcher/Putnam, 2000).

After conducting studies involving more than 6,000 people, Reiss has
found that 16 basic desires guide nearly all meaningful behavior. The
desires are power, independence, curiosity, acceptance, order,
saving, honor, idealism, social contact, family, status, vengeance,
romance, eating, physical exercise, and tranquility.

"These desires are what drive our everyday actions and make us who we
are," Reiss said. "What makes individuals unique is the combination
and ranking of these desires."

Reiss said at least 14 of the 16 basic desires seem to have a genetic
basis. Only the desires for idealism and acceptance don't appear to
have a genetic component. "Most of these desires are similar to those
seen in animals, and seem to have some survival value," Reiss
said. "This indicates they are genetic in origin."

The research is bound to be controversial with many researchers who
have tried to reduce all human behavior to just one or two basic
desires - such as pleasure, pain or survival - or who say that that
there are some desires that all people share equally, Reiss said. But
in looking at how people differ in these 16 desires, Reiss said he
concluded that "we are individuals to a much greater extent than
psychologists have previously realized."

For example, Reiss said our educational system is built on the
premise that all children are naturally curious (curiosity is one of
the 16 basic desires) and have the same potential desire for
learning. But Reiss found that people can differ quite a bit in their
maximum potential to enjoy learning.

"Not everyone is naturally curious," Reiss said. "A child may be very
smart, but still not be interested in school. But our educational
system cannot deal with the idea that there is someone who cannot
enjoy learning and never will. Educators are making a mistake when
they think all children were born with more or less equal potential
to enjoy learning."

Reiss said parents of non-curious children should realize they will
never be able to change their child's fundamental nature. "It's OK to
be non-curious. As long as the child is not flunking and is meeting
some minimum standards, parents should ease up on their expectations.
By pushing a non-curious child to be more curious, all a parent is
doing is ruining their relationship."

The same goes for any fundamental desire, according to Reiss.
Workaholics may work a lot, not because they have some void or
problem in their life, but because they have a naturally strong
desire for power and status.

In Who Am I?, Reiss uses the term "self-hugging" to describe the
assumption that what is potentially best for me is potentially best
for everyone. "Using self-hugging, we think that workaholics would be
happier if they worked less, even though workaholics say they are
happy as they are," he said.

The failure to understand individual differences causes problems in
everything from marital relationships to co-worker
interactions. "People know that other people have different values
and pursuits, but they cannot understand how this can be. Self-
huggers waste enormous effort trying to change people who do not want
to be changed."

How did Reiss come up with the 16 basic desires? He and Susan
Havercamp, a former graduate student, generated a list of more than
300 statements that refer to specific desires people might have.
Subjects in their studies were asked how much they agreed or
disagreed with statements such as "I love learning new skills," "I
must avoid pain" and "I would rather lose my life than lose my
honor." After testing more than 2,500 people, the researchers used a
mathematical technique called factor analysis that grouped the
responses into 15 fundamental desires. After testing about 3,500 more
people a 16th desire (saving) emerged from the factor analysis.
Based on this work, the researchers developed a test, called the
Reiss Profiles, that can measure individual differences in these 16
desires. Reiss said one key to the test is forcing people to think
about priorities in their life. For example, if you ask people if sex
is important to them, nearly 100 percent would agree. But, in
determining people's desire for romance, the Reiss Profiles asks
people if they agree to statements such as "I want all the sex I can
get." "That's a very different, very direct question," Reiss
said. "That's going to predict whether sex is going to play a more or
less dominant role in a person's life. Sex may be pleasurable to
everyone, but it isn't equally motivational. We want to find out what
actually motivates people."

Reiss said the research presented in Who Am I? shows that
psychologists cannot boil down human experience to just one or two
basic desires that we all share equally. He noted that 2 trillion
different profiles can be assessed by the Reiss Profiles. "Every
person has a unique desire profile," he said.
#


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
BERTRAM SALZMAN, MINDCALMING:

Dear Melody,

Thank you so much for your kind and generous remarks concerning
Mindcalming.

Mindcalming has a cleansing effect that you may have experienced
during
your Mindcalming session. The psychological residue that results from
the daily contention and conflict of modern life is a poison that is
the cause of depression and chaos of the mind. The resulting sorrow
that results is almost too much to bear . After many years of
research
and testing I have seen that Mindcalming is a powerful psychic
cleanser. For this reason I have introduced it to the general public
Online.

Mindcalming is not about anything but Caring. I know that it can end
the sorrow of the "Soul" I've seen it happen many times during
Mindcalming sessions when a person awakens for a moment to experience
her basic goodness... his basic innocence. If you know any who live
in sorrow send them to Mindcalming...there is no charge for the
sessions...also, urge them to take two sessions per day for at least
twenty days in order that they acheive more than superficial results.

A CALMER MIND IS A CALMER AND SANER WORLD. URL: www.Mindcalming.com

I Care that you Are.

B.W. Salzman (Bertram)

------

My Dear Friends,

For many years meditation was a difficult activity for
me. The mind refused to be quiet and the harder I tried to quiet it
the more chaotic it seemed to become. At that time I was also deeply
involved in studying the teachings of Sri Ramana
Maharshi...particularly the practice of Atma Vichara...Self Inquiry...
the inward asking of the question:"who am I"? I had my own particular way of
practicing Vichara:
Usually I would ask the question "who am I?" but I would
NEVER allow the mind to answer ,I would just hold the question in
suspension like a ball that I would not allow to hit the ground. One day
while doing this practice for not more than a few minutes the mind
(along with the ego) suddenly surrendered...naturally... by itself.
In place of the chaotic mind there was only a deep silence a natural
calmness and there was no one practicing ...It had been so easy!...
I sat down and began to do a session of meditation that lasted for
hours ...and there was no meditator no one meditating and as such no one
struggling to meditate. It seemed like a miracle! Later... I realized
what had happened: The short session of Atma Vichara(self inquiry) had
been a powerful "pre meditation " that had calmed the mind so that it was
easy for it to slip easily into the state of meditation. The mind did
not have to go from zero to 500mph in five seconds ...Infact the mind
is incapable of doing that...incapable of turning itself off that
quickly and that is why most Meditators have difficulty meditating .
But over the years I discovered that self inquiry is only one part
of one way of slowig down the mind and after a few more years of study
Mindcalming was developed. Its purpose is to calm the mind so that
meditation can happen and also to calm the mind during stressful moments
in one's daily life. But Mindcalming when practiced on a regular basis,
may also awaken one from the Ego dream of Individual consciousness..and
one may soon become grounded As the Universal consciousness. There is no
charge for Mindclming sessions ...it is a gift from the Eternal.
Visit: Mindcalming.com and discover your Calm Silent Self.

I Care that you ARE
B.W. Balzman (Bertram)

------


Dear ND friends,

By request, I have made Mindcalming sessions easily available to ND
members. Just go to the ND Links page and click on Mindcalming URL.
There is no charge for the sessions. If you are a meditator you will
find that the ten Mindcalming session will quickly set you up for a
longer meditation sitting...Also Mindcalming sessions reduce stress
and
helps one sleep better... when done at bed time.

I'd love to have some feedback from NDS members.

A CALMER MIND IS A CALMER AND SANER WORLD
GIVE SOMEONE A GIFT OF A CALM MIND



~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


FROM PATRICK COLLINS
thomasmerton@egroups.com

Repost:

Today is the great Feast of the Transfiguration, August 6. I have
always experienced it as the feast for contemplative consciousness. I
hope the same may be true for you.

I post today some words of Thomas Merton which seem to reflect some of
this Transfigured Awareness.

"A door opens in the center of our being and we seem to fall through
it into immense depths which, although they are infinite, are all
accessible to us; all eternity seems to have become ours in this one
placid breathless contact. God touches us with a touch that is
emptiness and empties us. He moves us with a simplicity that
simplifies us. All variety, all complexity, all paradox, all
multiplicity cease.
Our mind swims in an air of an understanding, a reality that is dark
and serene and includes in itself everything. Nothing more is
desired.
Nothing more is wanting... You feel as if you were at last fully
born.
All that went before was a mistake, a fumbling preparation for
birth.... And yet now you have become nothing. You have sunk to the
center of your own poverty, and there you have felt the doors fly open
into infinite freedom, into a wealth that is perfect because none of
it us yours and yet it all belongs to you."

MAY THAT BE YOUR EXPERIENCE THIS TRANSFIGURED DAY !

PATRICK COLLINS
--- End forwarded message ---


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

GENE / DAVE

Gene responding to Jerry:

Subect: Meditation in Lucid Dreams

NDS

GENE:
I am familiar with what you say here.

In my own such dreams, I have the experience of leaping vastly ahead,
and of preparing the future for myself. This includes pruning or
parsing my identity, to the point that I am undistinguishable from
the future.

This is no different in 'waking' or 'dreaming'. I admit that I have
lost the distinction between the two.

DAVE:
Hi Gene. I was asked the other day, "how can one define when this
goes over the line, or when one is dillusional or 'sane'?" There may be
many answers to this, I for instance have seen many ghosts and
memories and fears as part of the process of "pruning". Here too, there is
no doubt that the dream world and waking world are heavily linked, if
not one and the same. Were those "ghosts" real? I'd say YES they WERE!

My basic answer was, that "reality" is very relative. This is easy to
demonstrate, it can be seen that everyone has their own basic
interpretation of the same thing, and finally THE reality remains
uneffected. So, in that sense, everyone is dillusional. Finally it is
the status quo that dictates what is "correct". As you know, even today,
protection of the ego defines from the outset, dangerous activity ( as
that which could harm the ego).

For me anyways, lucid dreaming has been an excellent tool in the
expansion of the consciousness. It develops the disciplines required
to examine consciousness limits, and it opens one to the similarities
between dreaming and waking states, which is a key to the process
of awakening.... slingshoting one from the "limits of reality" in
dreaming to the "limits in reality" in waking. There is a tremendous
similarity after all between those two, and it is that which points
to THE reality, by contrast.


GENE:
If I don't like the future, I don't like myself. If I like myself, I
like the future.

I am like the future; when I get there, I will be only what I am.

Face it, the future haunts like a ghost, making identity squirm.
Whose footfalls are those, heard upstairs at midnight?


DAVE:
I've been looking at superimposed "empty consciousness" and "full
consciousness" in this last little while, I think that for me this
exemplifies the sense of future that you elude to here.

Ale (my wife, who is waiting for the moment to come forward here
with you all) and I were talking about the "why" of life, and
this concept of empty / full, fit the bill just perfectly, also
it is quite synergetic to the article you wrote on incarnation.

In a nutshell, "what better way to 'illustrate' the truth of
stainless space, than with it's compliment "full consciousness".

The beauty is that the two coexist as a perfect dance in creative
Compassionate Love.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~


MICHAEL:
Yeah! I'm learning to keep it down! :-)
'Sides, the plebes are starting to get hooked on the vibes. ;-))

HAHAHAH and HOHOHO!

Peace - just bub bub bubbaling along - Michael


GLORIA:
Sure now you decide to keep it down!! Geez, we could have danced longer if I
hadn't
needed to leave before I embarassed myself.
Ohhhhh, Ohhhhh, Ahhhhhhhh
Glo


And, the pictures don't even come close to seeing those eyes in person. And
people
call Andrew Cohen good looking....bleah. If we would ever take this Dog and
Pony
show on the road, we could be devotees of Bhagwan Sri Michaelanda ...no
acting
required!! We'll only call him Bubba backstage. Actually, pony rides for
the kids
would be a nice touch. Once Jerry gets us some books to sell, we are good to
go.


I like the HAHAHAH and HOHOHO! mantra ... and maybe a slogan like
"Nonduality works
for me, I sure don't work for it..." The laughing guru, one idea whose time
has come
back around.

Well, we got the charisma guy..the rest of the details hardly matter.

Gloria


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

GENE ANDREW and DAVE
Identity / Personality


GENE BEGAN:
During process of morning waking, one takes only a few slim volumes
from what is an infinite library, and this is the initialization of
identity. Being the essence of those few slim volumes, disqualifies
and thus makes invisible the 'rest' of the library; in this way, is
an individual made.
<snip>

ANDREW:
What occurred to me reading this post is that identity and
personality are not the same thing. Nor is personality dependent on
identity, though identity might be dependent on personality. In fact
it seems that the less identity the more intense powerful and free
personality becomes. It occurs to me that perhaps personality
carries identity as a burden. With a lighter load of identity,
personality remains. We remain diverse.


GENE:
Interesting observation. I give little thought to personality. Yes,
it does seem that personality carries identity as a burden.

Perhaps we (everyone) should carefully differentiate between
personality and identity. I observe that personality is
'involuntary', whereas identity is the product of clinging. This
clinging seems to arise during the challenges of social interaction;
if identity is challenged, more power is channelled to it, similar to
how in Star Trek, additional power is diverted to the 'shields' when
Voyager is under attack.

Long live diversity!


DAVE:
How about personality a flavour of identity, and in that sense,
very subtly provocative and "acceptable". Like if I'm going
to have ice cream, make it chocolate mocca with cherries.


~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

GENE and GLORIA:

NDS

Hi Gloria, you asked;

"What do you guys think of this idea of Being/becoming."

Here is the idea (From Belsekar):

"The individual self can exist only as a process of becoming, whereas THAT
WHICH IS is the perennial state of BEING. Therefore, its realization is
the annihilation of the individual."

Gene replies:

I can agree with this statement, but it does need further discussion.

I see 'becoming' as similar to our changing state awareness of a limb
which had been 'asleep' through deprivation of blood; as it
'awakens', we become aware of the details of its dimensions, weight,
etc. No matter how we try, we can only remember or imagine what it
was like to have a fully sensitive and responsive limb. When the
blood flow is restored, the limb is automatically reintegrated into
the sensorium of the body.

Similarly, I see this sort of defined 'becoming' as the awakening of
what was already 'there', and like the above-mentioned limb, the
awakening process can be quite painful; 'pins and needles' can lead
one to simply go back to sleep, and to continue to imagine what
wakefulness is really like.

Commonly, it is assumed that 'what is not' is 'in the way'
(obscuring) of 'what is', and that a transformation of consciousness
is required in order to 'see through the illusion', thus to banish
'what is not'. Actually, 'what is not' is not, and 'what is', is.
Becoming is becoming what is; and what is, is becoming. It is a
matter of restoring circulation; upon restoration, 'what is' is
everything from nothing to everything. Becoming is simply the I
opening, gradually or suddenly. Reintegration is inevitable.

Resistance is futile!

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
MARK and GLORIA

MARK CHRISTOPHER VALENTINE

The Beloved is a Hidden Treasure
(For the Mirror)

"I was a hidden treasure, and I desired to be known; therefore I created the
creation
in order that I might be known."
-Sufi Wisdom

snip

The Lover is never satisfied for more than a fugitive moment.
His burning, burning, burning, longing, longing, longing
is to become one with the Beloved. To become the wine,
the holy vessel, and by drinking, drinking, drinking, drinking,
become one and of the same essence that is the Beloved.


There is little the Lover can do but futilely attempt
to stand in the stillness and be present to the Rose.
And so, for a moment, at least, halt the relentless
procession of all Creation through devouring time,
its remorseless expansion into ever retreating space.
And patiently await, calmly stand, tranquilly sit, until,
His form begins falling and his essence wafting, until,
his burning fires his body to ashes and his soul to smoke.

________________________________________________________________________
GLORIA:
With gratitude for your poetry, here is one for you, Mark.


[You who never arrived]

You who never arrived
in my arms, Beloved, who were lost
from the start,
I don't even know what songs
would please you. I have given up trying
to recognize you in the surging waves of the next
moment. All the immense
images in me -- the far-off, deeply-felt landscape,
ciries, towers, and bridges, and un-
suspected turns in the path,
and those powerful lands that were once
pulsing with the life of the gods --
all rise within me to mean
you, who forever elude me.

You, Beloved, who are all
the gardens I have ever gazed at,
longing. An open window
in a country house --, and you almost
stepped out, pensive, to meet me. Streets that I chanced upon, --
you had just walked down them and vanished.
And sometimes, in a shop, the mirrors
were still dizzy with your presence and, startled, gave back
my too-sudden image. Who knows? perhaps the same
bird echoed through both of us
yesterday, separate, in the evening . . .

~Rainer Maria Rilke~

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~
DAVE and ALE:

Together, Ale and I decided today that Destiny and free
will combine to define the ultimate roadmap to the identity.

Destiny is the answer. As Gene said today,

<
"If I don't like the future, I don't like myself. If I like myself, I
like the future.

I am like the future; when I get there, I will be only what I am."
>

One must look at one's position and realize that THIS is the answer,
right here and now. We have chosen THIS. Any decision that we have
made to get here was one that we felt better than any other. As such
we must look at what our rationale is. For many of us, short term
relief is more important than long term freedom. This is a choice,
and one that is ultimately responsible for our long term freedom.

It does little good to critisize otheres or self for having made wrong
decisions, because at this moment we are as happy as we can be (be that
what it may).

In that respect, knowing Self and the Intent of full consciousness
is vital.

May the Force be with you.
nanoo nanoo.
Dave and Ale

~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~~

To a visitor who claimed he had no need to search for Truth because he
found it in the beliefs of his religion the Master said:

"There was once a student who never became a mathematician because he
blindly believed the answers he found at the back of his math textbook
—and, ironically, the answers were correct."

Anthony de Mello, S.J.

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