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#2479 - Tuesday, May
23, 2006 - Editor: Jerry Katz
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In this issue Praveen comments on the video, The Holographic
Universe - Beyond Matter, which was
mentioned in a couple of recent Highlights. The video can be seen
at http://snipurl.com/qv00 . A
response is given to Praveen.
Then Mee responds to Praveen's comments.
This series of Highlights in which I respond to people's
questions about nonduality is part of an
attempt to carefully and slowly explain the two-sided nature of
nonduality. On one side, we can
practice inquiry and attain an understanding of Self. On the
other side that understanding is gone
and what is left is reality. Since there is no bridge between the
two sides, a gap exists in which
both the enlightened and un-enlightened fall all day long. The
gap eats everyone.
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Praveen wrote:
Hi, I saw this video [ http://snipurl.com/qv00 ] and would like to comment.
I agree with the first part of the video. My physical world is
nothing but perceptions in my brain.
If i had a seperate set of senses, or even if the my brain
perceives the signals from the current
senses differently, then my external world will be 'actually
different'. My world is like this
because i am like this. That is clear enough for me.
But then, i have difficulty understanding from the point onwards
(after ~16 minutes in the video)
where the question is asked "Who is it that sees, hears,
perceives...Who is the being that says - I
am me" etc. Do you have to take it to an extra level and say
that it is actually the soul that
perceives and it is the absolute being? Is it not just guess work
to say that these perceptions are
given to soul by a higher superior creator?
Also i don't understand the concepts like 'There is only
God/awareness, Nothing is seperate from
God/Awareness, non-duality...'. Now i recognize that there is
awareness (which happens rarely for
me), but that is very private and personal to me.
Is it not just possible that the brain or the brain/body
(psychosomatic) is itself the perceiver.
Is it not possible that we are just giant biological computers
and nothing more. For me, the 'sence
of I' is created by thoughts and imaginations working on the
memory and interpreting the
perceptions. When there is bare awareness of the senses or
perceptions, there is no 'I'. Even when
the perceptions are minimum (like when you sit in a quiet dark
room), there is strong sense of I
when i am caught up in thoughts and imaginations.
Has anyone really 'experienced' this non-duality or this unity
with God/awareness/other beings?
Please share your experience and thoughts. Thank you in advance.
-Praveen
Response to Praveen
Hi Praveen,
You wrote as follows: [quote] Where the question is asked,
"Who is it that sees, hears,
perceives...Who is the being that says - I am me" etc. Do
you have to take it to an extra level and
say that it is actually the soul that perceives and it is the
absolute being? Is it not just guess
work to say that these perceptions are given to soul by a higher
superior creator? [end of quote]
The task is not to assign an extra level or to engage in guess
work regarding a superior creator.
When we do such a thing we are inventing reality. Rather, the
task is to consider, address, or
attend to the question: "Who is it that sees, hears,
perceives, etc. ... ." In the video the "who"
is called the soul.
They could have given "soul" any other name, such as
the Self. Whatever we call it, the only way to
know the "soul" is by getting into the question about
who it is that sees, hears, perceives, etc.
And we can do that. We just have to go to a good satsang, do
inquiry, practice as Ramana or
Nisargadatta have instructed, or simply surrender to the flow of
existence. We can do practices in
order to understand that we are this soul. No need to invent
anything.
Next the video talks about Allah as being the creator of the soul
and all perceptions. We have to
remember that this video was produced and written not for people
who read the nonduality lists, but
for people who have a spiritual sensitivity and awareness which
is more comfortable with terms such
as "soul" and "create".
We might want to replace those words. In the language of online
nonduality, soul could be the Self.
Instead of "create" we're more at home with
"arises". Instead of saying Allah creates the soul,
nondualists might say something like, "The awareness of Self
arises out of the Absolute and is not
separate from the Absolute." In the video, Ibn 'Arabi is
quoted: "The substance of these beings
which Allah created is but nothingness." Whether we say
beings or soul arose from Allah or that
Allah created them, isn't as important as seeing what is being
said.
Ibn 'Arabi is pointing to what Allah, the Absolute, or nonduality
is. He can only point because
there is no smooth transition from the understanding of soul to
the understanding of Allah as
creator of soul.
There is no bridge. Rather than a bridge which leads us from soul
to Allah or nonduality, there is
instant goneness of soul and then presence as what is called
Allah, the Absolute, Brahman, or
nonduality, whatever we choose to call it.
Take a piece of bubble pack, that plastic stuff used to cushion
packages when you mail them out.
We're going to pretend the bubble is one of us. As we press on
one of the bubbles, the bubble
flattens out, stretches and becomes thinner. In the same way we
become "stretched out" and thinner
and more transparent to reality as we grow spiritually and see
into the illusion of life. We may
become so "thin" that we are one with soul completely.
However we still do not know Allah.
There is no smooth transition from the state of being thinner to
the state in which there is no
bubble at all, Instead there is a sudden POP. And with the pop
the bubble is gone. The thinness is
gone. The soul is gone. The individual is gone. Gone-ness has
happened and it is sudden. (The
thinning of the bubble itself could be gradual.)
When the bubble pops and everything is gone, including the soul,
what is there? Only Allah or
nonduality, or, as you noted in your letter, "'There is only
God/awareness, Nothing is seperate
from God/Awareness, non-duality...'."
Also keep in mind that there is still life going on. There is
still "bubble-ness." For example, if
your finger gets infected, and a minute later you become
enlightened (the bubble pops), well, the
finger is still infected. You will still want to go to the
doctor. It is all Allah, right?
And on to your last question: "Has anyone really
'experienced' this non-duality or this unity with
God/awareness/other beings?" Unity can be experienced in
mystical states of consciousness or in the
everyday unbroken recognition that there is only presence. That
kind of unity can be achieved
through intention and practice. Or it can happen spontaneously.
However, there is no experience of Allah or nonduality, for when
the bubble pops there is no
bubble. There is no person, hence no experiencer. Have people
experienced the popping of the
bubble? Yes, we can read autobiographies, including those of a
number of online participants. I
don't know if they would say they are experiencing such
conditions as nonduality or unity with God.
Things like experiencing, feelings of unity, recognition of soul
nature, are all contained in the
bubble and the bubble is gone. There is only Allah, nonduality,
the Absolute or any other name we
wish to give it.
--Jerry Katz
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Mee wrote:
Namaste Praveen, i believe we have a silent witness that is the
observer. i also believe our human
condition is really a fragile tent that houses an enormous
spirit. we are part of everything and
everything is a part of us.
the dust that i plant my vegtables in could be someones
ancestors. the nutrients that break down
for eons are the very sustenance that feeds the plant that i eat
that will enrich the soil when my
human form passes away.
but what to do with that form while we are here. is it any wonder
why most people searching for
those answers are in roughly the same age group? you ever go to a
coffee shop after dark and wander
observedly around the place and notice the groups of people? how
they congregrate ?
each person has their own reasons they like or dislike so and so,
yet the silent witness ;which is
the Spirit: picks and chooses subtly what it is we need for
nourishment to get us to a place it can
blossom.
my place of being is that i believe we are born into blessedness
not orginating from sin.
over a lifetime this equates to a feeling of different
responsibilities towards self and others.
i have known my silent witness for a very long time. i was
gravely ill as a child and had two
occasions during adulthood that brought me even closer to it.
the first was respiratory arrest and an out of body experience
that did not feel unnatural only
hard to describe. the second event was being hit by lightening
and being priviledged to witness
another dimension to our "time".
the other single important event in my life has been attending
the dying and speaking to people who
have been in and out of comas.
they brought reality to some of what i have experienced as
"woo-woo" stuff that i had no
explanation for and set me upon a path to find out who else has
had these experiences.
i have since encountered a variety of people of all age levels
and economic and cultural levels
that have experienced these things thru letting go of the sense
of I. even if only briefly.
i used to believe that ego was what I was and was to be abandoned
with relish.
i am now of the opinion that ego if emptied could begin to
function as it is intended, in harmony
with the spirit that resides in all of us that we are part of.
you've seen it- someone you meet with that *something* in their
eye and smile.
a feeling where you just have to reach out and touch them. this
is God in formlessness reaching out
to experience itself. this is only my opinion based on my
experiences. as i grow older and more
disciplined and let go more, more will be revealed. man is a
going concern, never static ,always in
flux. i look at a drop of water caught in a rainstorm, and
instead of bemoaning the fact i have so
little, i can rejoice that a piece of the ocean is within my
grasp.
The Divine is in everything , shake the net and see if the mirror
image does not bounce off the
next pearl.
that pearl may be 90 yrs old and in the face of a crabby
man/woman, or in the smile of a 5 yr old,
it could be contained in the wonder and awe of a newborn as it
realizes that their fingers move
when they want them to.
you never know where the Divine will show up, could be the look
of frustration of a young woman
trying to contain two toddlers when you stop and hold a door for
her and relief and a thank you
lights her lips.
who is really saying thank you? the woman? or the Divine in her
recognizing the Divine in you ,just
for a moment ; nourishing both of your souls that knew of each
other but I was in the way ?
Response to mee
Hi Mee,
This is a beautiful response which I hear coming from the soul,
the Self, the Divine.
Jerry