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#1974 - Wednesday, November 10, 2004 - Editor: Jerry
This issue consists of more excerpts from interviews in the new book, This Is It, by Jan Kersschot. If you're interested in buying it at Amazon.com, click here: http://tinyurl.com/66az2
In these
interviews, J.K. is the book's author, Jan Kersschot.
Mark McCloskey
Rather than an interview, this is a conversation. Here is a
fragment:
MM: But tell me Jan, it is one thing to talk of all this and make
a declaration to the world that you and I see this, and that the
movie exists. It is quite another to integrate this vision into
living. After all, what good is any 'spirituality' if humanity
does not embrace it -- in other words, lives daily out of pure
silence or out of the Self, or from the place called 'Home.' It
seems to me that seeing the True Self as it is, implies that life
becomes 'selfless service' to that truth and each of us has an
implicit duty to shine to all those still in illusion. I find
that most authors writing about the Spirit leave it there as some
disembodied entity. To me that is not what it's about. Ultimately
we have responsibility to be compassion itself. The only thing
that we can do is plunge into the flesh, into suffering, and
perhaps try to enlighten the dark parts of the movie. I don't
remember who said it but there is an adage: 'Enlightenment is not
personal, it's for the whole, the other, as well.' I'm interested
in your thoughts on this as well.
JK: I am not sure whether we have to integrate our vision into
living. I wonder what is the real reason for saving the world.
And according to what standards are we going to do that? We all
know what the results are if two groups want to destroy the evil
in the world, when both of them have opposite opinions on what is
good and what is bad. I really wonder if all this struggle
against 'evil' is really doing humanity any good. I wonder why we
have to try to enlighten the dark parts of the movie.
~ ~ ~
My only concern with this chapter is that the author, not the
interviewee, has the last word, and it goes on for nearly two
full pages.
Eckhart
Tolle
ET: It seems to happen that it is also transmitted through the
written word. It is flowing out of that state. It is in the book
The Power of Now which people have read many times, and every
time the energy is fresh and new. Any spiritual writing that
comes out of this presence also contains that energy field. So,
the presence of the teacher may even be stronger than the
writing. The power of spiritual discourse -- whether is is
written or spoken -- is that there is more than just the words.
One could say that those words go deeper into the listener that
words that are purely informational. When the words are purely
informational, they are decoded by the mind and that's it.
JK: Then it is just an intellectual process.
ET: Yes. But here they are also decoded by the mind and then they
continue -- the energy of it continues to go deeper ...
JK: It echoes ... it resonates ...
ET: Yes. And then it awakens presence in the listener -- or the
reader. It awakens -- or one could say -- it almost pours it out.
It works on a deeper level. One could say that presence
recognizes itself.
JK: Like a mirror.
ET: Yes.
JK: In fact, there is only one presence, which is reflected in
many forms, including your book.
ET: Yes.
JK: What I found amazing is to discover that the person we all
think is inside, is simply not there. That there is in fact no
person living inside.
ET: Yes.
JK: Of course, it is not very popular to say so; your audience
might say, 'Oh, this is becoming too much,' or, 'This is
strange.'
ET: Yes.
JK: But in a way it is true.
ET: Oh yes.
Francis
Lucille
FL: ... Once you are open to life, it is a miracle.
JK: Yes.
FL: We could also explain this in terms of freedom. You see,
there are two kinds of freedom: there is freedom from and freedom
to. The first freedom we encounter on this path is the freedom
from the personal, to be free from the personal vision. Free from
ignorance. After you encounter this frist freedom, you discover
the freedom to. All the desires we had, they strangely get
fulfilled. Because the desire that we don't call upon as a person
becomes God's desire, becomes an expression of freedom itself.
Beyond any expectations. Desires get fulfilled way beyond that.
JK: There is abundance, but on the other hand there is also this
neutrality. A sense of neutrality, of not being involved
personally.
FL: Yes. You see, the objects are not desired for themselves, but
for the hand that gives them.
JK: The source where it is coming from, is your celebration, in a
way.
FL: The desire gets fulfilled only when we are detached from it.
And there is the revelation of the divine hand that delivers it.
U.G.
Krishnamurti
UG: There is one thing that I am emphasizing all the time: it is
not because of what you do or what you don't that this kind of
thing happens. And why it happens to one individual and not
another -- there is no answer to that question. I assure you that
it is not the man who has prepared himself, or purified himself
to be ready to receive that kind of thing. It is the other way
around. It hits. But it hits at random. It is like lightning: it
hits at random. It strikes at random. It has no cause. All this
seriousness about the spiritual goal ... Let me tell you that all
that wanting leads seekers nowhere. And I have nothing to give.
JK: No need to get serious about all this.
UG: What is the point of being serious about this subject? We
have said enough. It was nice meeting you.
JK: Thank you.
UG: Where are you from?
JK: Belgium.
UG: I love Belgium. I like their chocolate.