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James is on the dance floor:

Thanks
Jan,

Isn't it all a great word game.
Love is reflected in how one
treats another.

The other is you - this is both True and
False, neither True nor
False, and either True or False - and/or
any other word game the mind
wants to come up with.

The mind can never know Love. The mind is
Love.


OneDuality-NonDuality.

Tickled by the dance,
Love,
James

A sigh and a smile from Jeroen:

Time is the best teacher, unfortunately
it kills all its students.

but then who/what are these students?

Life is hard, it's breathe, breathe,
breathe all the time.

i breathe and smile :)
love,
jeroen

Bobby G. tosses one in:

Maybe it is the belief that a gooseberry
is an object that just sits
there unchanging that makes people look
for the same in themselves.

Love
Bobby G.

A taste from Jerry:

Thank you, Gene. Your article set me off into the realm of values
and valuiing:

It seems that only the finite can be valued. The infinite or the
ineffable can't be valued. God, a Higher Power, zero, infinity
have no value. When looked at by themselves, the infinite and the
ineffable can't be valued. They are sanctified, made holy. Then
they are brought into a value system.

Only the one who values, sanctifies. The one who doesn't value,
but see things as they actually are, isn't going to sanctify! How
is infinity any different than an apple? And what are they
anyway?

A great revelation came to me one day some years ago when I chose
not to go into a business venture with a very good friend. He was
on his way to 'big things', as any normal guy our age should have
been, and I was letting all that go so I could walk the beach and
write little poems.

So we're sitting in his car and I tell him I'm not going to go
into the business. He looked defeated. Maybe it was one last
ditch effort. Exasperated, he said, "Jerry, do you respect
yourself?"

At that moment it was quite evident that there was no Jerry.
"Who?", I answered silently to myself. I told him I couldn't
answer that question and that was basically the end of a very
good friendship.

He was asking whether I valued myself. No, I didn't. I didn't
value anything. It wasn't really a problem, social or personal,
to be solved.

As the moment arises right now it has to be seen without memory
or values. It is so instantaneous that it doesn't have time to be
valued or sanctified. Even as it installs in memory, that too is
a moment arising now and can be seen 'actually happening'. And
every connection of that memory with all other memories can be
seen in the moment too.

None of it is who one is. The play of consciousness, of the
Absolute is to hide that one thing not known -- who one is -- and
to watch it get found. It's existence playing with itself.

Everything is happening as the arising moment, as reality 'pops
into existence' once and forever. That's what actually happened.
When that meets I Am, or who one is, it is seen as who one is,
and then the extremely transcendental, nonduality, all the
highest spiritual knowings, are gone.

First valuing goes, then it is realized that if nothing can be
valued, nothing can be sanctified. Then the extremely
transcendental -- that which is known but neither valued nor not
valued, neither sanctified nor not sanctified -- is, what I call,
'essenced'. This is the becoming of the Absolute.

Jerry

Jan gives us something to ponder:

Dear Bobby,

Suppose a gooseberry of 50 grams is launched from an alien space
station. Final speed 100,000 km/sec and direction, the moon. The
impact will unleash an energy of 2.5*10^14 Joules... It would be
quite a spectacle, well visible from earth. That the berry is
mushy at room temperature is of no importance, nor are its other
properties ;-)

Love, Jan

And from hellman:

There are so many ways, and for those who burn not one is
sufficently fast. This why the grace of a teacher can really help
burn out the fire that just goes on itching until the search is
over

hellman

A bit from Jody R. (responding to somebody who, i couldn't tell
because of a Yahoo! ad)

It has happened, but in nearly every case we see the presence of
a teacher.

There are as many cases of people coming to self realization
without the presence of a teacher as there are with.

James self-evidently vibrates with this:

Hi Jan,

The observer is the observed is the resolution of the paradox.
This means that there is no identification as 'the observer' -
the fact that there is no entity is what is self-evident.

In the same way there is nothing implied - things are as they
are.

The more things change the more they remain the same. This is
also self-evident - there is no entity that it has to make sense
to - it is simply the nature of things.

So there is the Stillness of Now and yet there is Movement.

The illusion of dualism is a consequence of commentary. Without
this illusion - how could there be speaking of something labeled
as a 'game' or 'consciousness'. It is the speaking about it that
is the source of the illusion.

Asking the question, 'Who am I?' is dualistic. This self-evident
fact is the resloution of the paradox and the question implodes.

Stillness and Movement are the Same Thing!

Love, James

And Finally:

An excellent article on the need for spiritual practice, by Greg
Goode PhD. (no less) can be found on Harsha's new magazine issue
at -

http://www.harshasatsangh.com/MagazineV2/GregPractice.htm

Thanks for putting your education to good use, Sir!

As Found on Other Lists

TheEndOfTheRopeRanch

Dan and Ed dialogue.

Hi Ed,

Ed:> Of course, your original post implicitly and explicitly addressed
> this question to others, to ask themselves "what and where am I
> avoiding reality?". But I appreciate the opportunity to empathize
> with your own apparent avoidance of reality.

(Dan)
The avoidance enters when there is investment
in dividing reality, keeping "me" apart from "you."
You are the only one who can resolve the attempt
to keep that split going, no one else.
Which is to say, I am the only one who can resolve
the attempt to keep that split going.

Your supposed empathy for me about my avoidance
out there, apart from you, keeps the split going,
apparently. As does mine for you ... :-)


> I too may appear to be avoiding the reality of wholeness, reading
> your posts as if something was being said of value to a
> supposed "me." My apparent avoidance would be the expectation of
> some change or improvement possible, in extending the meaningful
> existence of a supposed "me."

True.

Resolution of apparent separation
is the simultaneity of all phenomena.
Events a million years ago, and a million years to come,
not separated.
Yesterday and tomorrow understood as conventionally
separated, not separated in reality.

You and I are this same simultaneity.

>
> Moreover this supposed "me", is apparently avoiding the reality of
> wholeness in engaging the perceptual memory and "mind" in this
> sequential process of reading and writing, apparently the very
> antipathy of wholeness.

If you see through it, then the film that divides
me from you, inside from outside, is dissolved.

The words are understood as having conventional meanings,
without any real division in reality taking place.

The "unconditioned reality" is, as always, itself.
Who you are = who I am.

>
> Apparently all such communication between supposed entities would
> appear to avoid the reality of wholeness.

If there is investment of energy in having
the separation as reality, yes.
If no investment, then the conventional ways
of using words, thoughts, perceptions make
no problems.

> I may further appear to be avoiding the reality of wholeness by
> seeing that such avoidance is simply an appearance, and by knowing
> that nothing can be done or not done to avoid the reality of
> wholeness within any supposed power of a "me," since wholeness IS
and
> is simply unavoidable.

Yes, nothing is added to it by calling it "wholeness."
And nothing is added by communicating about it.
Neither has anything been taken away.
And communicating is fine with me.

> So let's keep talking. :-)

Sure. No problem, mate :-)
>
> Empathically, Ed

Emphatically,
Dan

On Yearning, Mazie speaks out:

Dear friends,

I recently joined and posted on a forum of a fellow who I knew
from another yahoogroup, a man who I clashed often with, and very
painfully so, for I disliked any unfinished grievances that do
not get mended. I did. I thought I would never be able to get on
with this fellow, and especially I thought I would never join his
forum. I marched right in there and stepped up and started right
in babbling about love and getting it on with God, and all that
other crazy talk I do. I could not help myself. It was some other
Love-baked, fried person's fault that I did that. I have found
that lately, since I became a fully freaked-out Love machine, no
turn-off buttons, no shut-down turny-thingy, I am just going full
melt-down all over the place. I cannot stop myself from spilling
over everyone and everything that gets anywhere near my orbit. It
is the really coolest, wildest, most flipped out in a
make-no-sense kind of thing, it is. We are always talking about
wanting to get that kind of love, that Love where we are left
unable to keep sleeping around in every heart that even slightly
opens up that honey pot to us. Love just wants to get it on with
every single heart it sees. Why all the sensuous, the erotic talk
in discussing this Love, this sacred and Holy Love we so want,
this enlightenment thing? Because Love has been stripped of its
human-ness, its natural heat and fire, and its very lifeblood. We
think (or at least I did) if we cut away any closeness, any human
feeling we will be able to touch God in that pure and slick alter
we have made of untouchability. Not so! If we cannot kiss God
right in the heart of our own beloved each day, with
unconditional and undying love, we cannot hope to ever find Him
in some sterile, self-imposed tower of "Keep-awayness" I should
know. I have been the glacier-queen for endless years spouting
all the time about celibacy and yoga and ego and bullshit
bullshit. It was what my teachings led me to believe. Oh there
was room for relationships, but something seemed missing about
Divine Passionate Love. I was born a Lover, a real Heart-Ache. I
have a heart that re-blazed itself into a Human Firepit. God
said, "Well, well, what do we have here, a little smart-ass
talker of the Love talk, thinking she, SHE has a grip on what I
AM, what MY LOVE really IS! Well, let her bite on this, taste
THIS kind of Love, little poet!" And then He proceeded to just
yank my ass all over Love- Street. I am a train wreck and I don't
know anything but the love of crashing into a firey wall of
annhilation. I just want what Shams and Rumi have been trying to
show me all along. A human, real, living love, not some dead
rhetoric that knows all the answers and none of the sweet
pleasure positions of God. Well, well, well, what do we have here
now? A freaked-out, crazier than ever lunatic in Love's Madhouse.
Come see me some time. We get out every time the full moon rises.

Love, Mazie

The poetry corner of a Zen order

Muhammad and the Huge Eater

http://www.hsuyun.org/Dharma/zbohy/Poetry/huge-eater.html

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